Monday, November 30, 2009

Testing the Inosine+DMAE formula

In the series "Immunovir versus Inosine Revisited", I discussed the antiviral drug Immunovir (Isoprinosine) as well as the possibilty of a homemade substitute. While Isoprinosine is made from inosine and dimethylaminoisopropanol (DMAIP), from reading the patent it seemed the general idea was to use an amino alcohol to alter the way the inosine is absorbed into the body, and while DMAIP is preferred it seemed like dimethylaminoethanol (DMAE) could have similar effects. DMAE, but not DMAIP, is available as a nutritional supplement, along with the inosine. If one can't get the real Isoprinosine tablets, mixing inosine and DMAE might be a good alternative.

I purchased bulk DMAE bitartrate and inosine from iHerb.com, brand name Life Extension. A common dose of Iosprinosine is 3000mg per day (six 500mg tablets), so to make roughly 3000mg of the inosine+DMAE combination, I mixed 1 and 3/8 teaspoons of the DMAE bitartrate and 1/4 teaspoon inosine (plus an extra little pinch of inosine) into 1.5 cups of water. The water is cloudy at first but with a minute or two of stirring it gradually becomes clear. This gives three doses of a half cup each.

In order to test for side effects and what not I decided to take only one dose on one day, then the next two doses the following day. So the first day I drank my half cup, and I gulped it down pretty fast. The taste is very acidic even though it is supposed to have a neutral pH. I ended up with some pretty severe acid reflux that lasted for almost the rest of the day. I also got a slight headache which could due to either the purported antiviral effect or just a side effect of the DMAE. Excitation and insomnia are two known side effects of DMAE but I did not really experience that (I have occasional insomina anyway). I did have some more-vivid-than-usual dreams and paradoxically actually felt I slept better.

The next morning I took another dose with similar results as the first day. Slight nausea, stomach upset, acid reflux, slight headache. That evening, I decided to only take half of a dose and got the symptoms again only not as bad.

Okay, so I decided to take a break for a few days and try to figure out a way to mitigate the gastro-intestinal side effects. Eventually I tried again, only this time I cut the DMAE bitartrate down to 1 teaspoon and increased the inosine to 3/8 teaspoon, again mixing into 1.5 cups of water. However, this time, when it came time to take each half-cup dose, I diluted each dose again into another cup of water and drank it slowly over the course of about 30-40 minutes. This time I had no acid reflux at all and only very minor stomach upset from the acid taste. It seems the extra dilution and drinking much more slowly instead of gulping it down helped tremendously. Isoprinosine comes in tablets so it probably takes at least 30 minutes for them to dissolve in your stomach anyway, maybe longer. Hopefully I can increase the DMAE again back to the original level and still keep the GI effects at bay by diluting it more and drinking it more slowly.

In addition to buying the ingredients in bulk and mixing them into water, one could also mix the dry ingredients only, add a filler of some type, and stuff it into capsules. It seems like it would be necessary to dissolve them together, but the original patent claims that the inosine and amino alcohol can be given separately, "as long as they have a chance to get together in the body of the animal." An even more convenient (but less flexible) way would be to take about 250mg of inosine and enough DMAE bitratrate to equal about 250mg DMAE by buying tablets and capsules in the necessary size. Usually inosine is sold in 500mg tablets so they would need to be cut in half. Source Naturals sells DMAE capsules in a size that gives 351mg DMAE bitartrate (130mg DMAE). So for each dose, one could take half a tablet inosine and two capsules of the Source Naturals DMAE, and this would equal a total of 952mg; approximately equivalent of two 500mg tablets of Isoprinosine.

Note that the amount of DMAE is much higher than someone would ordinarily take if they wanted to take a DMAE supplement. Whether this would result in side effects, or if the side effect profile of the inosine+DMAE combination is different than each component given separately, remains to be seen.

I am still debating whether to take the homemade version full time or if I should figure out a way to get the real Isoprinosine. But it requires a prescription, would cost several hundred dollars a month, and might be ceased by customs when attempting to import it. On one hand, I'd love to save the money and hassle by making my own, but on the other, I don't want to waste time taking something that might not work as well. Either way, I definitely think this is a much closer substitute for the real thing than merely taking inosine alone despite what Doctors DeMeirleir and Cheney have said.

8 comments:

  1. I am assuming you have had organic chem, in-organic chem and can draw out the molecules in question, at least, to figure out what some of the bi-products might be if toxic when you combine and how to remove these. If not, is your life not worth the money to try the drug? Why hurt yourself potentially? Liver damage that might even be irreversable?
    Yes, I know and don't blame you wanting to get on with your life. I don't blame your impatience. Ask what your life is worth for you to experiment on it where it might cause harm. I have had CFS for 22 years but not out of High School.
    Estee

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  2. Thank you for your concern but I feel comfortable with the safety profile for inosine and DMAE, both over the counter nutritional supplements. I have no reason to believe that combining them would be toxic as no chemical reaction is created. The patent describes how these components are metabolized (separately). The drug Isoprinosine, while not the same, is similar and is known to be very safe and is available over the counter in Europe.

    This doesn't mean I am trying to persuade other people to try this. Readers should know anything they take that is not FDA approved makes them a guinea pig and there are risks involved. This blog is meant to be a journal to document the treatments that I undertake and my experiences with them.

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  3. Good luck on your experiments. I'm looking forward to your PART 3, Results. Anything we can do to save money and actually be able to afford medicine is worth the effort.

    I have purchased Isoprinosine from www.anti-aging-drugs.com/?chapter=immunity#isop.

    It cost:

    $79 for 50 tablets (500 mg) and $158 for 100 tablets (500 mg) PLUS SHIPPING $14.00 (either size, same shipping cost).

    On 12/10/09, the company appears to be out of stock. Oh no! And I have the FLU and find Isoprinosine has cured it, in the past, completely in a day or two. Oh well, back to the old garlic, vit. C, plain inosine, etc. for now [sniff sniff, cough cough].

    I've bought this from this company a few times in the last couple years. I used my charge card and have had no problems. PD

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  4. Addition to above Post: At the 'Anti-aging.drugs.com' website, no prescription is necessary. And they just replied to my question: "Are you out of stock?" with a YES.

    They suggested I buy from LIFE EXTENSION DRUGS at www.life-extension-drugs.com/isoprinosine.html

    Their prices + $12 shipping are:

    Dosage ------ Packing ------ Price

    50 mg/ml sirup 150 ml USD 67.00
    500 mg 50 tab ($1.74/tab) USD 87.00
    500 mg 100 tab ($1.59/tab)USD 159.00
    500 mg 200 tab ($1.39/tab)USD 278.00
    500 mg 400 tab ($1.33/tab)USD 532.00
    500 mg 600 tab ($1.27/tab)USD 762.00

    It appears that they also do not require a prescription.

    Just curious, do they ask for a prescription if you are buying from a country other than the U.S.?

    Email me at pamdressel@yahoo.com. Thanks. Hope this info is helpful. PD

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  5. Re: Your experimental tries with inosine and DMAE. Maybe take it with orange juice instead of water to eliminate the ACID REFLUX problem.

    I cured my acid reflux/heartburn with an old fashioned remedy:

    10 oz ORANGE JUICE with 1 to 3 teaspoons white vinegar in it. It also makes the orange juice taste more tangy!

    It works well in pink lemonade, too. Or use another way to take vinegar. A friend takes apple cider vinegar by the spoonful for this problem.

    The vinegar also cured my elderly Dad's chronic, daily acid reflux. He'd been taking medication for 20 years for this problem before trying vinegar.

    If you try this let me know if it helps with your acid reflux & your 'homemade' isoprinosine. Thanks. pamdressel@yahoo.com PD

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  6. I've been taking inosine since last summer. I take 3x500 mg on Mon, Wed and Fri and 1x500 mg on other days, to mimic the isoprinosine protocols used by CFS/ME specialists. Occasionally I keep a 1-2 week break. It has helped me quite a bit, though initially the effects were stronger.

    It never occurred me to combine inosine with DMAE and I don't think this is an important part of the treatment. Coincidentally I did try DMAE for a few months during the time I've been taking inosine and it did not result in any benefit. I stopped taking it because I was worried that the excess acetylcholine was worsening my trigger points and since I thought my problem was dopamine, not Ach deficiency (soon afterwards I started tyrosine, which has helped quite a bit too, confirming my suspicion).

    P.S. I couldn't find your contact info, but I was wondering if you would be interesting to receive a free electronic copy of my book "Reviving the Broken Marionette: Treatments for CFS/ME and Fibromyalgia" to review for your blog. If you're interested, please contact me at book@brokenmarionettebook.com.

    P.S. Isoprinosine is not "available over the counter in Europe", at least in most European countries. It is a prescription drug and e.g. here in Finland it is a prescription drug even though it is not sold here, which is why I'm using inosine. DMAE is also considered a prescription drug here (even though you can't buy it) and possibly some other countries. Even normal inosine used to be on the list of Rx drugs.

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  7. Try Goldpharma, where I get isoprinosine (generic). Rx is provided by them (for a small fee ($8), and you can get 90 500 mg tabs for $62.20 including the Rx and shipping. Using the protocol Klimas tested you would need 90 tabs per month: take 2 tabs three times a day on weekdays for one week, then 1 tab 3 times/day on weekdays the next week and alternate for 6 months. Total cost for 6 months would be $373. Your recipe, while innovative, does not sound amenable to long term therapy! I wish I knew if it was going to help me, though. Anyone tried it with good benefit? How long did it take to notice an improvement? Thanks for "listening".

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  8. valentinelynx, thanks for telling me about the isoprinosine dosing protocol Dr. Klimas uses--I had been looking for it. What happens after 6 months, do you keep taking it or do you take a break and then continue? Thanks also for mentioning the place to buy it from, I did buy some isoprinosine from them and noted it had fewer side effects (actually basically no side effects at all), whereas the DMAE component of the substitute version gave me insomnia, vivid dreams, etc. You are right...I guess I got a little too excited, but the Inosine+DMAE thing doesn't seem like a good idea especially long term. If only we could get dimethylaminoisopropanol, we could make a homemade version that is identical to isoprinosine. Thankfully the good prices offered by the site you mentioned means there isn't as much of as an advantage to making your own anyway.

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